Conversations about Meher Baba

Irwin Luck: Amartithi Message, Jan 31, 2026, live on Baba Zoom

Dear Lovers of the Lord and anyone else who likes him.I am giving a talk about my experience of the first Amartithi when Meher Baba gave up his bodyin this advent of His. I was there to help cover his body. I will tell you about what happened and the intensely intoxicating atmosphere surrounding the area during my time there.Hosted by Diana Goodheart in NCThis event was recorded live. To be first to be notified of a new video on this channel, please hit the red subscribe button, then the notifications bell. To join future live events, see www.babazoom.net. Please join our Facebook group: www.facebook.com/groups/meherbabafamily

Late Night Chat with Jeff Wolverton: E&G: ”Realization vs. Effacement,” Jan 26, 2026, live Baba Zoom

Dear folks of Baba,“The way of My Work is the way of effacement, which is the way of strength, not of weakness and through it you become mature in My love."- Meher BabaIn the coming chapter, Darwin Shaw writes about the path of self-effacement encouraged by Baba. It was a new concept for most of us, and the term is rarely used even in spiritual circles. Simply put, it involves vacating our interior, so to speak, and letting Baba move in. His mandali would use the phrase: “When He takes over.” This transformation does not occur instantly, but gradually over our lifetime as we surrender our interior to Him.In my view, Baba affirms two major spiritual approaches, that of self-realization and that of self-effacement. On the path of self-realization, we seek to realize our spiritual potential, going up through the planes of consciousness, gross, subtle and mental, to realize our own divinity. Many of the saints are on this path. On the path of self-effacement, which Baba guided most of His mandali and close ones on, is about vacating our interior and allowing Baba to live our life, with us as the witness. In the Bible are the words, “Not I, but Christ liveth in me.” Unlike the path of self-realization, self-effacement means giving up even our spiritual experiences, which can be so compelling. Rick Chapman, in his meeting with Baba at Meherazad in 1966, was told by Him, "In fact, pay no attention whatsoever to the spiritual path, the planes of consciousness, or to any spiritual experiences—they are all nothing but toys for children, because they are nothing but illusion.” In this approach, Baba is implying to even renounce our "spiritual experiences " in favor of self-effacement. Such spiritual experiences are still in the dual realm. In truth, Love is the higher self, which is ever-present in everything, in what is “unspiritual” as well as “spiritual.” It is a matter of realizing Love heart-to-heart with Baba and each other, not chasing after spiritual experiences. The one Love that surrounds us and is ever-present only needs to be cleansed of its impurities, and its sanskaric veils removed.In clarifying the two approaches, Baba gave the metaphor, as Irwin Luck shared with me, of two methods of taking down a large tree. Paraphrasing, in the first method, we go to the top of the tree and cut down, say, ten feet of the topmost branches, and then we come down another ten feet, and then another and another, until we reach the base of the tree. This is like going through the inner path of consciousness, plane by plane, until Divinity is reached. In the second method, continuing the metaphor, Baba introduces termites into the bark of the tree, and gradually the tree is hollowed out, so that to all intents and purposes the tree appears to be thriving at the gross level. We remain at the level of the world where we can express Baba’s personal love to those around us. Baba becomes the indweller, and we become vehicles of His love in the world, rather than regarding our self as the base of operations. The remembrance of Baba in any way, shape or form acts like an invasion of termites that eventually destroys the tree.As has been said, Baba affirms both paths. The path of self-effacement allows us to empathize with others in the gross world; we are spared the infinite vastness and complications of the overwhelming experiences of the higher planes. However, we are nevertheless exposed to the experiences of the ups and downs of life in the gross world. Baba has said, “I will teach you how to move in the world, yet be at all times in inward communion with me as the Infinite Being.” On the path of self-realization, the bliss of the higher planes makes it difficult for the advanced aspirant to truly empathize with others in the gross world; there is sympathy and the sharing of the higher expression of love, but empathizing with others as they experience themselves at the gross level is not really possible. Among the myriad methods leading toward self-effacement, adopting the provisional ego is essential, in which we imagine Baba as living our day and doing everything through us. What starts as a mental exercise eventually becomes our actual experience, the gradual transition from micro-managing our lives to letting Baba take over. And of course, focusing on Baba in all the ways that we can is paramount, making Him our constant companion, which over time, gradually effaces our ego in Him. “I believe that as spiritual aspirants our concentration should be on loving God and merging with Him, and the predominant process we are engaged in is not self-realization but complete self-effacement, which is both total annihilation and complete merging of the personality self into God.”- Darwin ShawP.S. We are continuing on page 61

Late Night Chat with Jeff Wolverton: E&G: ”No Villain is Required,” Jan 19, 2026, live Baba Zoom

We have some informal chat after every arti, the "post-arti party"! But once a week, Jeff Wolverton joins us for some serious mining of the spiritual depths. Join us for conversation, more readings, songs, quotes - you never know what treasures will be uncovered! The Topic: No Villain Is RequiredDear folks of Baba, When I went off to college in 1962, although coming from a free-thinking, fun-loving and non-religious family, I nevertheless naively bought into the world as being the “reality" as it is described in the excellent article below. I think probably all of us did. This was before Baba entered my life in January, 1968. It was soon after that I found myself going to Darwin and Jeanne Shaw’s meetings in Schenectady, N.Y. Darwin would speak of the myriad ways of the world as a “mayavic trap”, and at the time I felt, although he radiated such a rarified love, that he was a bit too detached from the world—ha! He didn’t seem to see some of its valuable and creative possibilities—haha! My parents encouraged my siblings and me to strive to leave the world a better place. Now decades later, I find my orientation toward the world has changed 180 degrees. What I had struggled with for years and found most difficult to resolve is this: How do I express the love within me in this world without getting bound up in it? Ultimately, I have had to give up even "my own loving agenda" in regard to the world and actually liberate Baba’s Love in me from my agenda—who would have imagined that! I had to quietly step out of the game and let Baba and His Love do its own thing. Here are Baba’s magnificent words about our purpose in the world:To penetrate into the essence of all being and significance, and to release the fragrance of that inner attainment for the guidance and benefit of others, by expressing, in the world of forms, truth, love, purity and beauty—this is the sole game which has any intrinsic and absolute worth. All other happenings, incidents and attainments can, in themselves, have no lasting importance. To me, this has meant to not live in the world on its terms, but on Love’s terms—Baba’s Love has its own agenda. How is this done? This is taking me a lifetime to fathom. The article below describes succinctly how difficult it is to disentangle from the clutches of the world. It is not only colorfully written, but in my view, reveals a very profound insight into the subtlety of Maya, the principle of ignorance. It bears studying. I should say that it isn’t written knowingly from Baba’s point of view. In His love, JeffA link to the PDF of Effort and Grace: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xrR75eksY-tErdKZm9aOBs3omuhioasb/view?usp=sharingTo join the email list for Late Night Chats, contact Angela

Late Night Chat with Jeff Wolverton: E&G: ”Maintaining Inner Momentum,” Jan 12, 2026, live Baba Zoom

Dear folks of Baba,Darwin Shaw’s book, Effort and Grace, is an in-depth inquiry into the inner life with Baba. It describes one of the major approaches to Baba by one who was devoted to Him for over 70 years, which culminated in a glorious intimacy with Him. Darwin was always so encouraging and optimistic in what we can do to open up to Baba’s immediate loving presence. He asserts that many of the blocks to this intimacy can be removed by our inner efforts and by inviting Baba’s ongoing intervention and grace.He would often stress the importance of tuning in to our inner momentum at various times throughout the day and inspire those thoughts and feelings in ourselves that keep Baba front and center in the moment. We were encouraged to ask ourselves: Is what I’m doing creating that inner aliveness that moves me to remember Baba and awaken His loving presence or am I drifting into an uninspired mood that is just filling up time and space? There are countless ways that we can enliven our lives that may not overtly seem like a remembrance of Baba, like spending hours out in the garden planting flowers or taking our grandchildren to play in the park—activities that are entertaining to Him. One of Eruch’s most often quoted words of Baba were: “To be natural is most godly.” Baba didn’t say to be spiritual or good is most godly.What Darwin warned us against is falling into a state of inner inertia where we find ourselves “just existing”; such states make more work for Baba in us. There are many things, both inner and outer, that we can do to keep our spirits up. Baba has said, “The aspirant who attempts to reach the goal carries with him all the sanskaras he has accumulated in the past. But in the intensity of his spiritual longing, they remain suspended and ineffective for the time being. Time and again, however, when there is a slackening of spiritual effort, the sanskaras hitherto suspended from action gather fresh strength and, arraying themselves in a new formation, constitute formidable obstacles in the spiritual advancement of the aspirant.”It requires great sensitivity to tune in to our inner current at the level of the heart: Is it flowing toward Baba and life in the world or is it stalled and even receding? Because, Darwin would say, once we get trapped in spiritual inertia, it has a way of sabotaging our efforts to draw closer to Baba. It puts off our efforts till tomorrow; it causes us to get too caught up in duties that drain our inner vitality, distracting us from remembering Him. Returning again and again to Baba in our thoughts and heart center is ever available to keep our inner vitality alive. As Baba said, “Don’t go anywhere without Me.” Over time the companionship with Baba enters into almost all the moments of our life; for some, He is ever-present. Equally important is to lose ourselves in the things we love doing, which, as Eruch says, is an unconscious remembrance of Baba. Such a life keeps us out of the lower frequencies of the world, what Darwin calls “our habitual paradigm”, and lifts us into the higher vibrations of the soul.Often Baba lovers and spiritual seekers come to the Center because they have reached a state in their lives where they feel they are stagnating, and they find that Baba’s presence on the Center and their receptivity renews their inner life and sends them on their inspired way. Going to Baba places and joining Baba get-togethers are often natural ways of keeping the inner life with Him alive. There are valuable practices that I inherited from the mandali that elevate my day. In my early years with Baba, I would wake up and immediately check in with my mood, that is, my sanskaras, to see how was I doing. Those first groggy impressions would then color my day and narrow my day down. From Darwin and Eruch, I learned to first check in with my connection with Baba, the joy and privilege of knowing that He is in my life, and that would give a real inner momentum to my day. There are many such practices that lift us out of ordinary consciousness. Witnessing Kitty Davy over the years, I could see that she came to each moment intensely aware and alert; there was no such thing as being half-aware or sleepy. She was fully present for each one, from the mailman to an elderly Baba lover to a small toddler, giving them her best for Baba. I never saw her bored; there were no moments when she was only partially aware and uninspired, and she carried that spirit right up to her hundredth birthday!The mandali told us if we take one step toward Baba, He takes ten steps toward us.What do you do when you find yourself in a dull period of the day or for a longer stagnant period in your life? How do you re-ignite that original spark that inspired you to draw closer to Baba and the inner life?In His love, JeffP.S. We are continuing on page 61A link to the PDF of Effort and Grace: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xrR75eksY-tErdKZm9aOBs3omuhioasb/view?usp=sharing

Late Night Chat with Jeff Wolverton: E&G: ”The Value of the Opposites,” Jan 5, 2026, live Baba Zoom

Dear folks of Baba, Whether we like it or not, Baba has built into Creation the conflict between the opposites such as good and bad, masculine and feminine, justice and injustice, superiority and inferiority, repression and indulgence, moral and immoral. These opposites make their appearance at the level of daily life. When these opposites clash, like the two poles of a battery, they generate great power, both positive as well as negative. The energy released when the opposites meet, if integrated properly by us, has the potential of lifting us out of the dual realm and propelling us to a higher level, giving us an experience of oneness. More often, however, the conflict of the opposites initially evokes a negative reaction in us, and we attempt to suppress one of the opposites and accentuate the other.Do we perceive these conflicts as originating in others alone or do we perceive these conflicts as coming from Baba through others? In either case, a great deal of adjustment is usually required to resolve the clash of the opposites. Our inner harmony can depend on whether we take these opposites and the often herculean adjustment required as a challenge from Baba or an irritation manufactured by the world. Can we find the third position, as Carl Jung, the famous psychiatrist, referred to, beyond the duality where the conflict of the opposites is resolved? According to him, whenever there is any problem, there will be two opposite approaches for resolving it. Neither solution will be correct, but must undergo the tension that will result, if one perseveres, in a third approach. That third approach will result in an integration of the duality within the individual’s psyche. Darwin says, “The combination creates a balance of the opposites; the tension of the paradox creates a current, releasing the locked energy, creating momentum, and canceling out both of the opposites. The effect is that we are bringing together two forces, a positive and a negative, which ignite and create energy, and, together with the self-denial that is part of the spiritual path, precipitate the consciousness to a higher level. However, if you act on [only] one of them, the current is diffused.”In explaining this phenomenon of opposites, Bhau, one of the intimate mandali, would occasionally say, “Sometimes it takes a nightmare to wake us up from a pleasant dream.” We have a great resistance to being awakened even when it is for our own good; we tend to resist change and so easily justify our negative reaction. There are many ways that the conflict between the opposites makes its appearance. Baba gives the example of the polarity of the masculine and feminine qualities in us. When these opposites are embodied in two persons as they interact, they can generate a tremendous energy and even inspire a lifelong love and devotion. Someone in love can cross deserts on foot, suffering incredible thirst and hunger, just to be with his or her beloved. But also, if a person loses their loved one to someone else, especially if jealousy enters the picture, the energy created by the polarities can result in a lifelong hostility. Both responses generate great energy. Baba says that to overcome the polarity of male and female is to overcome much of the problem of duality. In the Discourses, He writes, “The transcending of the sex duality does not amount to overcoming all duality, but it certainly goes a long way towards facilitating the complete transcendence of duality in all its forms.” To overcome this duality, Baba says what is required for the individual is to experience, through imaginative or intuitive projection, what their partner feels themselves to be in their own experience, rather than viewing their partner through their own personal lens. In this experience, the individual finds a third way, a resolution above duality through non-identification with the gender of the body. And this third way comes about through the energy brought on by the clash of the opposites itself, which Baba uses as a tool for our awakening. Baba describes the ultimate challenge of rising above the opposites in these words: Remember in the future, that when anyone hurts you, it is I who hurt you; when anyone loves you, it is I who loves you; when anyone laughs at you, it is I who am laughing; when you love anyone, it is I whom you love. I am in all things. How can you realize My infinite presence if you shrink from me in those who hurt you and welcome Me only in those who please you? In His love, JeffA link to the PDF of Effort and Grace: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xrR75eksY-tErdKZm9aOBs3omuhioasb/view?usp=sharing

New Year’s Day Quotes sharing meeting, Dec 31, 2025, live on Baba Zoom

Participants are invited to bring their New Year's Day Quotes to share, out loud! Personalized Quotes are sent out via email to anyone who is listed in the Baba Zoom Community Directory. If you did not receive one, feel free to bring any favorite Baba quote to share! Tech host Diana Goodheart in NC This event was recorded live. To be first to be notified of a new video on this channel, please hit the red subscribe button, then the notifications bell. To join future live events, see www.babazoom.net. Please join our Facebook group: www.facebook.com/groups/meherbabafamily

”Christmas w/ the Living Christ” Charles Haynes &Christopher Wilson, Dec 24, 2025, live on Baba Zoom

"Christmas with the Living Christ" - a Christmas message from Charles Haynes and Christopher Wilson.Hosted by Diana Goodheart in NCThis event was recorded live. To be first to be notified of a new video on this channel, please hit the red subscribe button, then the notifications bell. To join future live events, see www.babazoom.net. Please join our Facebook group: www.facebook.com/groups/meherbabafamily

Late Night Chat with Jeff Wolverton: E&G: ”Beyond the Dual Realm,” Dec 23, 2025, live Baba Zoom

Dear folks of Baba,Once in Mandali Hall at Meherazad during the 1980s, Eruch shared with us about the phenomenon and nature of the dual realm, which divides everything into opposites. The triune attributes of Infinite Knowledge, Power and Bliss, when they come down into this world of Illusion, are divided into opposites. Thus, the Infinite Knowledge of God is divided into ignorance and worldly knowledge, the Infinite Power of God is divided into weakness and strength, and the Infinite Bliss of God is divided into misery and happiness. The Supreme Being, when it incarnates in this world of Illusion, takes the forms of masculine and feminine; Adi, Baba’s secretary, shared with us that Baba had told him that in this advent, Mehera is playing the role of His feminine counterpart.For eons of time, we are caught at the level of duality, trapped more or less in one opposite or the other; we invariably think they are the only options we have. It usually doesn’t occur to us that we can go beyond the dual world of opposites into the Divine Realm within and experience our intrinsic completeness, the oneness of our Soul. Baba has said that the trajectory of human beings is to basically go from bad to good to God. However, we first have to entertain the possibility of going beyond duality by giving up our obsession with the opposites such as worldly knowledge as opposed to ignorance, strength as opposed to weakness, and happiness as opposed to misery. Darwin was forever encouraging us in so many ways to leave the seemingly safe harbor of the opposites and set out with Baba into the unknown open seas. In his words, “Why strive to become something in the dual realm when you have to let the whole realm go? “ In early childhood, we lived for a time in the realm of relative oneness, but as we grew older, we set out unconsciously to make our mark in the world of duality, to make efforts to achieve our future goals, to educate ourselves to do so, and to strive to arrange for ourselves a secure place in the world. But then Baba entered our lives, usually when we were most vulnerable, calling us to leave the dual world behind and join Him in His realm of Oneness. And as Baba says, the challenge is to do this and still live a practical life in the world at the same time!Baba is our ticket out of the world of duality. In this world of preferences, how can we prefer Him above all our other preferences? How do we get out of the world of duality? Our efforts should eventually be directed toward focusing entirely on Baba in each moment. One of the major hurdles we have to rise above is our unexamined identification with what Darwin calls our personality self. It is the personality self that has myriad preferences--all our ambitions for achieving things in this world such as success, control, comfort, recognition and pleasure. We have to go beyond the personality self which Darwin referred to as merely “a storefront for the soul. We make such a big deal of the window displays, changing them with the seasons when we could enjoy the priceless merchandise inside!” We have to create some inner space between our personality self and our consciousness (our soul). The personality is meant, as Darwin would say, to be a “conduit” or vehicle for love and the soul, not a base of operations as it is for most of us.To focus on Baba in any way, shape or form is to immerse ourselves little by little in the Oneness beyond duality and the personality, and this can be experienced in our day-to-day lives. It is the quickest and fastest way to move beyond the opposites. We choose loving Baba over wanting the many things in this world. The two major ways to rise above duality, according to Eruch, are: remembering Baba consciously and the losing of ourselves in activities that we love (which is an unconscious remembrance); it’s hard to realize that losing ourselves IS Baba! Baba is always there within, ever ready to personally help us in this. As we focus on Him, our attachment to the dual realm begins to drop away from sheer neglect. There is a gradual psychic shift from seeking fulfillment in the world to finding fulfillment in Baba. He is the very embodiment of Oneness that leads to inner freedom beyond the opposites! As Dr. Harry Kenmore, one of the Western mandali, would say, “You can’t get perfection out of imperfection no matter how you contort yourself. Perfection has to reach in from the realm of Reality and pull you out!”What flashes of insight or painful experiences have moved and even driven you to see that you need to move out of the dual realm? What stages have you gone through that would indicate that you are moving toward Baba’s Oneness?Mother Theresa describes beautifully the state of being a vehicle for divine love:"I am a little pencil in the hand of a writing Godsending a love letter to the world."In His love, JeffP.S. We are continuing with chapter, Expressing Ourselves

Sahavas for Everyone: ”Love”, Dec 17, 2025 live on Baba Zoom

Sahavas for Everyone. Avatar Meher Baba is in each one of us. And His Love is the focus of this gathering. Open discussion with each session having a topic or theme. Hosted by Laurent Weichberger in SC. Meher Baba and His "Twelve Ways of Realizing Me," way #12"LOVE: If you have that love for Me that St. Francis had for Jesus, then not only will you realize Me, but you will please Me."Jai Baba!This event was recorded live. To be first to be notified of a new video on this channel, please hit the red subscribe button, then the notifications bell. To join future live events, see www.babazoom.net. Please join our Facebook group: www.facebook.com/groups/meherbabafamily

Late Night Chat with Jeff Wolverton: E&G: ”Losing Ourselves in Doing,” Dec 15, 2025, live Baba Zoom

Losing Ourselves in What We DoDear folks of Baba, Most of us are struggling with how to live in and relate to this world. When we were with Darwin, he spoke often of being detached from the world, but in my early years with Baba, it was not really clear to me what this meant. It was Eruch who helped me immensely to see life in this world from a unique and more comprehensive perspective.There was a time in 1975, before starting at the Meher Center, when I was working for a buddy of mine painting houses, which included doing fine interior jobs over in Briarcliffe Acres, just north of the Center. In this upscale neighborhood, we had to do quality work. Back then, I would describe myself as a Baba remembrance machine; I would say “Baba, Baba, Baba...” inwardly with each brush stroke, while sanding, caulking, cutting in windows and baseboards. In my early years with Baba, I tended to do everything in extreme. I worked with my buddy for six months, and then we went to India. One day at Meherazad, we were sitting just outside Mandali Hall on a bench with Eruch, and my buddy said, “Eruch, I work as a house painter, and sometimes hours go by and I haven’t even thought of Baba. He is the most important One in the world. He asks us to make Him our constant companion, and I let hours go by and I’m not even remembering Him. What can I do about that?” Eruch replied in his very casual way, “In the beginning, it’s important to remember Baba, repeat His name, to see the movies, to go where Baba has been, and to read the Baba literature. But in time it becomes important to forget yourself. When you forget yourself, then Baba can live through you. You’re not aware of it, but He is living through you. So, lose yourself in your painting.” He highlighted the supreme value of self-forgetfulness, and his words unexpectedly resonated to the depths of my soul and were forever emblazoned in my heart. Previously I would have thought that losing yourself in painting was like burying yourself in the complete mundane; what has house painting got to do with spirituality and Baba except, maybe, earning a living in the world?That moment outside Mandali Hall was a turning point for me in my life with Baba, because I had become a bit too serious, rigid and truly obsessed with remembering Him all the time. I had lost the playfulness that had always been a part of me since childhood, the spontaneous enthusiasm of my college days, the genuine fun in life that I had experienced over the years. Since that brief, life-changing conversation with Eruch, I have found that self-forgetfulness and the conscious remembering of Baba make a vital and complementary dynamic in my inner life. Eruch would say, “Get wholeheartedly lost in your activities, and when coming out of that absorption, remember Baba.” And he would add, “When you remember to remember, remember Him!”So, this is how I translate Eruch’s words into my life: when I get wholeheartedly into something, such as volleyball or music or gardening or a conversation, I forget myself. Baba then can live through me as Eruch has said even though I am not aware of it. And after the activity, I remember Him. So, it’s an alternating between Baba remembrance and self-forgetfulness. I found, when it was all Baba remembrance, I would become a little stiff and unnatural, and if it’s all self-forgetfulness, that also can sometimes become unbalanced, like watching football all weekend on television. Self-forgetfulness and Baba remembrance, for me, work beautifully and harmoniously together. Baba liked games, skits, jokes and movies, because in them we forget ourselves. I asked Margaret Craske’s dancers, most of whom were deeply devoted to Baba, if they remembered Him out on the stage in the midst of their performances. They all said that they remembered Baba before going on stage, and then lost themselves in their dancing. Afterwards, they would dedicate their performance to Baba. They had all tried at one time to remember Baba during their performances, but they confessed that it didn’t work; it took away from their total absorption in the dance.So, Darwin’s encouraging us to become detached from the world, through Eruch, took on a much deeper and more practical meaning for me. I am approached by young people, many of whom have computer jobs in which they are absorbed for hours with data and digital work. They often confess that they don’t find the work fulfilling. What Eruch has said gave a new and different meaning to their work, giving them permission to be wholehearted in what they do, knowing that Baba is living through them and is vitally present. And in the moment when they come out of their absorption in work, they can remember their Beloved! In this way, they are actually “in the world, but not of it.” In time, this approach, with its effacing of the self, leads to the knowing that Baba is the sole doer of everything.In His love, Jeff